Today we have some news to discuss about our upcoming release of ef-the first tale. Those of you who have already looked at the product page probably noticed the “Reduced Mosaics” tag, and we’ve received a statement from minori which we’d like to share with you in order to explain this matter, and show you exactly what “Reduced Mosaics” entails. Read on to view their statement.
We would like to first apologize to those who are eagerly waiting for the English release of “ef – the first tale” for all the delays.
We have been making progress, but because the matters we’ve been working on are not things which get shown to the public, many of you might be thinking, “What the heck are they doing?” However, in order to release the title as an acceptable product, there are many problems we must resolve that occur away from the public eye. There are still several hurdles we must overcome before we can release the game, but there is a matter that we would like to discuss with everyone overseas before that time comes–namely, the way those of us in Japan think about ethics.
We operate under the fundamental principle of “make it clear who will bear responsibility for the release.” In the domestic Japanese market, our products undergo inspection by EOCS (The Ethics Organization of Computer Software), and the business known as minori bears responsibility. This is because they establish a standard for what level of expression is considered to be socially acceptable within our society’s constantly changing values, and passing inspection means that we have abided by them. In contrast, this release is not undergoing inspection by any organizations such as the ESRB nor the PEGI. When we discussed this issue with MangaGamer.com, MangaGamer.com made it clear that they will be the ones who will preside over ethical issues and bear responsibility. In other words, the release of this English version was possible because it was made clear who would accept social responsibility for it.
This is exactly where the main problem with “fan translations” lies: the product that we made in accordance to the ethical standards of Japan winds up being circulated outside of Japan without a clear responsible party. If this work circulated without our input happens to cause some kind of trouble, who is to take responsibility for it? Will the fan-translation groups who went and translated it on their own take responsibility for us? No, that probably won’t happen. What is likely to happen, is that we will be held responsible since our existance is clear and we are the ones who developed the game. And of course, we won’t be held responsible merely for the product we created, but also for the effects any problems surrounding that work has on our society and our industry. As such, allowing this to occur poses a serious risk to our continuation as a company. That is why we decided not to ignore this risk, and to release an official English version.As we move towards the release, one of the major problems we face is how to treat the concealment of genitals (hereafter, mosaics). Though MangaGamer.com has requested us that we release the product without mosaics, it was our decision to include them as we did in the Japanese version.
There are several reasons behind this decision, but the biggest of them all is that we, minori, are a company who conducts business in the Japanese domestic market. You can imagine what would happen if we were to release a product without mosaics, can’t you? Such data would be leaked back into Japan with almost 100% certainty. With networks now being worldwide, this is only a matter of course. Yet for us, this poses nothing other than a business risk.
In the past, people have developed tools to extract the data archived in our games. We requested that they cease distribution of this tool, and there were times when we took the problem to the court. As a result, some people have listened to us and ceased development, but there are also other people who claim fair use as a shield and continue to develop such tools. It is an extremely sorrowful matter, but so long as there are people who refuse to comply with our requests to stop, we are forced to take measures against them as we have to bear responsibility as the developers of our games.
In other words, if we were to make the uncensored CG available to the world, then some inconsiderate person would extract the data from our archives and leak the CG back into Japan. If it was just the CG alone it might be a different matter, but one can easily imagine that just as many of those fan-translating bishojo games have done, someone would then take the English version’s CG, create a patch that allows one to play the Japanese version with uncensored CG, and spread that across Japan as well.
This poses a significant possibility of jeopardizing our business. Even if these games have passed the ethical standards for domestic release in Japan, it is not uncommon that they are not accepted outside of Japan. (You all remember the incident in Canada, right?) Similarly, even if mosaics are unnecessary abroad, so long as there is a chance they will leak back into Japan, we must abide by Japanese standards. This is because we, minori, are a Japanese registered company and there is always a possibility that our business may be held responsible if our releases for the western audience happen to cause problems due to such differences in standards. We believe many fans may remember the “Rapelay Incident”. So long as we remain a company registered in Japan, we cannot avoid such issues.
However, if one were to examine other media in the Japanese market such as manga and videos, it does seem to appear that the mosaics used in bishojo games are a bit too big. So, we carefully examined the treatment of mosaics in other media distributed within Japan and decided to revise the mosaics to a level that we believe should be socially acceptable even if it were to be leaked back into Japan. (Please take a look at the sample images provided in this post.)
(Sample 1) (Sample 2) (Sample 3)
One day, when the bishoujo game market expands in the west and Japan becomes but one small, local market, then perhaps minori may decide to cast away its Japanese nationality. However, so long as the present worldwide market for bishoujo games remains a very small one in comparison to the market in Japan, we must abide by our domestic laws. It would be impractical for us to abandon the Japanese market at the present time (If we were to abandon the Japanese market, minori would not be able to exist in the world. It would mean death for our company.)
It would be wonderful if one day, bishoujo games became more worldwide and we were able to establish our base in San Francisco! (Cool in the summer, warm in the winter, nice all year round! Perfect for all the fatties here at minori!) If that day comes, then surely we would be able to produce our works according to a global ethical standard.
It may be slow, but progress is steadily being made in the localization.
We apologize for the long wait, but we hope you’ll give us a little more time.
I think I’ll just comment now before the storm (that I have no intention of reading) hits. 🙂
1. Personally, I couldn’t care less about mosaics. But I do find minori’s reasoning for keeping them rather silly and paranoid.
2. I can understand minori’s dissatisfaction with fan translations. But I do find this particular piece of reasoning… yep, silly and paranoid.
All in all, I’ll just shake my head a couple more times at this statement, forget about it and buy ef anyway. What is much worse, in my opinion, is that mosaics will hurt MG sales somewhat. But then again, those who absolutely demand uncensored eroge tend to lean towards sex-oriented titles, so maybe it won’t be so bad.
Despite my previous below I agree that they are a tad overly paranoid. Understandably so, however, but still paranoid. It pays to be cautious in this sort of thing, however.
Apart from that, people played the censored fan translated version. I think they’ll be willing to upgrade to a LESS so version with a (hopefully) better translation.
Overly paranoid would be an understatement. Why should Minori keep their cg censored when every other company that mangagamer made deals with offered their games completely uncensored?
If i was mangagamer i would have never accepted this deal. Why should i buy this when i could just download the english patch from the internet. There is virtually no difference beetween the game with the english patch and the one offered by mangagamer.
I think they didn’t heard of photoshop (decensoring power). The MG mosaic will make this job easier.
yes, it is silly and paranoid. (who give a sh*t, Japanese didn’t waited MG’s version of ef to have uncensored things)
So the mosaics are being kept…whatever, I’m still buying this game. I will say thank you to minori for being honest, albeit a bit long winded.
Now hurry up and get back to work on ef so I can give you my money! lol
On a side note, since the game’s first chapter starts in winter, anyone here think it would be ironically funny if it comes out the same time as The Winds of Winter?
LOL, so minori is still paranoid…WHO DIDN’T SEE THIS COMING???
I for one support this decision.
Yes, it is a shame that I will not be able to play this game completely uncensored, but minori has a great point. This is also part of the reason so much “hentai anime” have NOT been brought over uncensored lately, it is far too easy to simply bring it back to Japan, where they do not have uncensored scenes of this nature.
Now I don’t mind the idea of tweaks and I am not against them myself, but I do understand why THEY are. And it is acceptable to me, as both companies could, potentially, get into legal trouble.
Besides, the reduced mosaics are enough for me in comparison, I want this game for story and not porn. I can deal with it. So long as I get it at all I am happy.
I don’t blame them, but “what a narrowed mind”, imagine the anime producers doing the same (not especially hentai I mean) : “Why buying 6*90 yens when abroad it only $50”.
and if others companies was doing the same, VN wouldn’t sell the same.
Those Japanese releases will have a lot higher bitrate to work with, and foreign releases (at least until BluRay hit) did not play in domestic DVD players.
Only if you live in the US. My DVD player does and always has played Japanese DVDs happily, as well as my local DVDs, and vice-versa. Less so blu-rays, so saying that foreign versions didn’t work before is flawed.
Yes, but the US was (and probably still is) the primary export market for localized animation when companies had to consider the reverse importation issue. In fact, it was still a topic of debate in the industry at least a couple years ago (haven’t followed the industry as closely recently).
“Yes, but the US was (and probably still is) the primary export market for localized animation when companies had to consider the reverse importation issue. In fact, it was still a topic of debate in the industry at least a couple years ago (haven’t followed the industry as closely recently).”
“Numerous articles have been written about the depressed state of the North American market in terms of anime and manga from Japan. The situation is so bad, many Japanese publishers and companies question if it is even worth while to attempt to market something to the US. I believe this is going too far, as I remember a time, just 20 years ago, when there was no real market in North America. There were a few titles released in English back then, but they were far and few in between.
But on the ground here in Tokyo, the pessimism is very strong. Many creators, producers and publishers talk about France and China as their best targets for export. France and China are not huge markets in themselves, but Europe’s market has not tanked as badly compared to the US and while its hard to make money out of China with its numerous regulatory barriers and rampant piracy, East Asia overall represents a market that is growing and the prospect of consumers with more disposable income is very good.”
The new mosaics look really good! As someone who imports games anyhow censoring has never been a dealbreaker for me but I’m glad MG found a compromise 🙂
The legal world is a bitch, yo.
just out of curiousity, why is the original statement dated: “Nov.04 2011 minori”?
Because the statement was originally written in November 2011, when the decision to do so was first made, but due to delays on both sides, it took this long for the game to reach a point where we could unveil the catalog page.
As much as I think that mosaics are a product of silly, too-conservative cultural norms, Minori isn’t being paranoid–they’re practicing sound business.
I’m definitely buying ef when it comes out, and I’m just glad Minori was able to reduce the mosaics to the extent that they did.
I can understand where they are coming from, but this post is worringly lacking in detail. Is this requirement to have “someone to take responsibility” a legal requirement in Japan, or a social one? If legal, is it only for creators of sexual content, or anything considered in some way harmful?
And what exactly are they taking responsibility for? Some sandy-vagina’d soccer mom getting offended over a penis? Does every piece of content released in Japan need a target to sue behind it?
What possible legal argument could this soccer mom have against minori if uncensored CGs were leaked back into Japan? If that soccer mom could somehow make it minori’s fault that their art for overseas release was misused, then surely it would become the fault of the department store where someone breaks in, steals a knife and stabs someone with it? After all, no matter the intentions of the store, that store released the item that could cause harm!
A bit farfetched perhaps, but if someone actually managed to sue minori for overseas art being illegally(?) re-imported, then it would likely have *very very* dangerous implications for the Japanese legal system.
Well, it’s not like I know anything about law anyway.
Also: that vagina is fucking ugly, I would rather it was fully censored so I don’t lose my lunch during H-scenes. Can’t blame them, no point putting effort into art that will be obscured in the final product.
I think minori just really took that entire Equality Now episode to heart and it scared the shit out of them…
Minori doesn’t really do nukiege and especially not rape games, so it would be hard to raise such a shit storm over their products. I think they just don’t want any attention…
While I still don’t like the idea of censoring, I do respect the reduction in mosaics as opposed to no reduction at all. The reduced mosaics certainly are less obnoxious.
I think they are silly and I can’t agree with their reasoning.
It’s normal to have censored porn in Japan, but it’s not normal for me. As such, with the knowledge that it will be a, albeit reduced, visually censored release, I won’t buy it. I’m sorry for MG, but I guess I’ll be waiting even more for their other releases.
So, is this long winded entry just a “We’re sorry, but we’re keeping part of the mosaic?” ? I don’t care about minor censorship like that, so, should I skip reading this?
I have a question. If reverse image importation is such a big deal, then why do some of MG’s title releases have CG’s without censorship (i.e. KM or Kara no Shoujo).
Did Innocent Grey go out of business? Do they have a mountain of legal suits to deal with before they can continue production?
OK I think we all know the answer to these questions. The conclusion? Why doesn’t minori look at past examples and realize they are being bloody paranoid.
It’s a question for Minori, why ask it here?
You’re right. Why ask a rhetorical question with the appropriate article when he can take 5 years to learn Japanese, fly to the country, track down their offices, and ask an employee that question.
What was he thinking?!
So…. What about Innocent Grey, Overdrive, and all the other companies? They didn’t get in trouble.
minori is worried when this genre gets more in the open in the future. Troubles can occur at any time from any where.
Look at Rapelay, it took almost 3 YEARS after Rapelay was released in Japan till some guys completely unrelated to them rose the controversy.
All the other companies are taking that risk.
On the one hand, like others, I can’t help but feel minori are being overly paranoid here. No other company whose eroge have been published in English have had an issue with the removal of mosaics, at least not to my knowledge.
On the other hand, I’ve lost count of the amount of times I’ve viewed an uncensored erotic image and recoiled at the sheer horror of what confronts me. Often the genitalia is badly or sketchily drawn, or looks to have been redrawn, presumably because it was never meant to be seen by its original audience. Hence, there are several English language releases in which I wish the the mosaics had been left intact.
In short: a non-issue for me. I can’t wait for ef, naughty bits or not.
Also, is the presence of mosaics reflected in the price? Because €25 is a princelier sum than I expected for such a high-profile title.
You might need to make other censors as I just made this in photoshop within one hour… http://i.imgur.com/A0sWj.jpg
Oh no, you’re in trouble now minori. A mostly decensored CG from your game has been uploaded onto the internet. Your worst fear has come true, it’s only a matter of time before it appears in Japan.
this will only be the first tale iirc, I imagine they dont want to sell both games at a higher price.
Well, sometimes I wish we would be fighting with aliens so we on have bigger problems on earth than the censoring of drawn genitalia.
However, I will buy the game as it looks like the kind of game I like and the German influence in architecture makes me proud. Even German rail stations are looking cute drawn in anime style. <3
I can live with it. While I, like everyone else, would clearly prefer no mosaics at all, the important part of the ef translation has always been the translation itself. If I knew enough Japanese, I’d absolutely buy even the original, but since I do not, this will be my chance to show my support to minori for creating such a great story.
First of all. It’s a shame they don’t get de-censored.I understand the reasons and I hope future VNs won’t be left with mosaics.
Looking at the samples it almost doesn’t matter, but it still does. I’m sure this will stop a few from purchasing the VN, but who knows.
Second. minori. Don’t ever ever go to the United States. Political correctness, Christian values and moral crusaders will ruin every one of your VNs.
I’d rather have the whole screen censored than that. A lot of topics are taboo, whereas in Japan these sort of taboos does not exist. This in turn allows the the writers and the artists to do things which they wouldn’t be able to do in America.
I don’t know if you live in the US, but a lot of it depends on what state you’re in, and sometimes even what part of said state.
For example, somewhere like Alabama would likely have a total fit over even talking about sex in a VN, let alone showing it. Meanwhile in southern California they wouldn’t even know what to complain about from the lack of any problem.
As far as I can tell, Ef was officially licensed by MangaGamer back in September 2010. I’ve been looking forward to it since then. The TV anime adaptation was licensed by Sentai Filmworks in July 2011. Season one is already available on region 1 DVD and Blu-Ray. I don’t mean to be impatient, but…
Right now I’m still willing to buy Ef. But at the same time, I’m trying to support VNs with no adult content or harem stories. Some fans and companies have been (and still are) creating visual novels that fall outside the usual genre boundaries. They may never overtake adult harem games, but I’m hoping they shake things up.
I’ve never minded mosaics much, but the new “reduced” mosaics are quite impressive. I’m startled that they’re actually sufficient by Japanese standards.
But note that Marek is over-generalising. As BD said, if I buy this game I’ll be getting it for the story not the H-scenes, so I wouldn’t mind even if the full original mosaics remained.
So how are you guys going to compete with, uh, a “previous release” of ef (actually just a half of it) now that the only substantial advantage is lost?
This post was an ideal moment to mention some extras included to compensate for the remaining censorship of HCGs and since none of the said extras are mentioned here, we basically have an official confirmation of the fact that minori isn’t interested in overseas fans’ money in the first place.
Good luck selling this one, because it being the least pirated game of yours (do you have any doubts?) won’t really help.
I was considering buying it, now I don’t have to think about it anymore (and no, it’s not about the pixels, it’s because of the attitude.)
The mosaics issue aside, this is an interesting and honestly look at some of minori’s company philosophy.
I, like many of the others here, do believe they’re being paranoid; however, they do clearly explain that their stance is one taken out of a desire to hold responsibility while avoiding any legal or ethical affront to their company. Basically, is it paranoia? Yes, probably. Is that okay? Yes, it is. Honestly, whether or not I agree with their stance on the mosaics. I applaud their effort to protect their company (and their employees by proxy) since it comes with such a forthright explanation.
I personally was unaware of ef’s impending official release, but after reading that, I’ll be keeping an eye on this.
You are now aware that one of the MAJOR reasons to buy this release has been eliminated.
Now people are left with only one reason to buy this release
[ ] To support paranoid Minori
What you lost was the only reason people cared about this release
[ ] Uncensored cgs
Wouldn’t it make more sense for anyone wanting to support Minori directly to buy the Japanese version of the game? It’s significantly more expensive (not even taking the lousy exchange rate into account) than MG’s version will be, all your money will go to Miniori, and you get a boxed copy.
It’s not possible that people are buying localized versions of VNs to support the future localization of similar titles? Their only possible reason to buy a localized version of a VN that didn’t focus on the sexual content is for the uncensored sexual content?
I actually own both Latter and First tales.
Its not a problem at all, seeing high quality titles localized is much more important.
No it’s a big problem yet,supporting these Minori’s paranoid is a big foolish at all u.u
I applaud the effort minori and MG went through to explain their decision, and the effort made to reduce the mosaic in order to make some people happier. Fundamentally speaking mosaics is censoring (albeit self-censoring in this case) so less is typically always better. Even ethically speaking.
The explanation from the post is interesting to read but it leads to some questions/statements that I think should be clarified:
1. Does this mean, basically, MG is on the hook for this game? If I have questions etc, I should ask them directly right? I guess this ought to be the case for any games MangaGamer is producing and releasing, anyway. But if minori is going to prioritize their domestic market and customers, doesn’t that mean MangaGamer is at a disadvantage? I hope minori realizes this and do something for MG to make it up.
2. I’m sure a lot of you readers know but what is the ethical basis in terms of mosaic application in Japan? I mean I understand genitalia is censored in pornography in Japan, but that alone doesn’t explain all the implications in terms of the uncensored images making it back to Japan and things like that. In terms of ethics it’s not clear if it is more or less responsible to do the things minori has decided. Or at least, you probably don’t want to leave me to my inferences and it is most prudent to spell it out for everybody first.
For the record I think I have a vague idea why this is the case, but I hope someone spell it out for all the non-hardcore gaijin readers, just so there’s no misunderstanding here.
While completely uncensored CGs would obviously be nice, I’m still okay with the reduced mosaics. That’s mostly because the story is ef’s strong point, not the ero. Apart from one or two occasions in the game the ero is just a nice extra. An extra I gladly accept. But I could even live without it.
I agree. The story is the main draw here. The game has been delayed for so long now. If they need to do this to get it released, I’m not going to argue.
It’s a shame Minori will never read this.
What a nice explanation this is of why we’re ending up with a censored version of EF.
Too bad it’s nothing but lies, strawmen and paranoia.
Lies – None of the companies currently involved with Mangagamer who have released uncensored copies of their games have received any backlash or reputational harm for doing so.
Strawmen – Rapelay? Really? 1.) You’re comparing a story driven game with a rape simulator but 2.) IT WAS CENSORED ANYWAY! IT HAS NO BEARING ON THIS SITUATION!
Paranoia – Someone might rip the images and put them in the Japanese game? And? 1.) This would come under copyright infringement, which is already covered under Japanese law and 2.) Unless there’s a Japanese law which makes companies responsible for everything that someone MIGHT do with a product (which I doubt), there’s no danger for Minori anyway.
I think Minori is just trolling the Western audience, considering previous encounters with them.
Minori is really special. I’m not too sure why MangaGamer actually want to go ahead and waste their time with them. No offense, but they just don’t want to work together with you guys. Scared of backlash? Seriously? Rapelay had a backlash because it was a 3D rape simulation. The games from Minori have nothing special except BITTERSWEET FOOL which I doubt would ever be localized anyway.
They do sound a bit xenophobic in this blog.
I hope they can get over it
Trunkmonkey > they don’t just “sound”, like all the posts on sankaku complex about minori. One of the funniest part (about blocking their website to non-japanese ip) :
“If one of our products or the site itself were viewed overseas it might be a crime, and the viewer might become a criminal in their country. Since that would be our fault, it would be most regrettable.”
You do know that you created your own straw man in the “Lies” section of your comment, right? :p
I’m OK with the reduced Mozaics like they show in the expamples.
I really happy to be able see the Minori excellent works finally avalable for purchase for the rest of us in the world.
While I admit that it is somewhat disappointing that ef will be censored, I can understand minori’s reasoning behind it.
minori have done a fantastic thing by allowing their game to be released overseas. It’s uncertain territory, so I can’t complain about this.
And hey, if this were just a fan translation, we’d still have mosaics. At least now they’re not so noticeable. As another commenter pointed out, it’s easier to ‘demosaic’ the image in Photoshop now. 😛
I think they’re being weirdly paranoid but I’m not them and it’s their decision. The new mosaics look fine to me, I really don’t care as long as I get to play. 🙂
I’m of two minds about this.
On one hand, I don’t see a problem with the reduced mosaics themselves; there’s a fair amount of detail and it doesn’t take much imagination to make up for what’s missing. Anyone with a fair amount of artistic skill could redraw the images and release them to the public (not unlike, say, the decensor patches for Fate / Stay Night and countless other titles).
On the other hand, I don’t agree with minori’s excuse for opting against releasing the uncensored ef graphics to the English-speaking world. Let’s be honest, here; this really is nothing but an excuse:
Visual novels have been released in English, completely uncensored, for around two decades now, and not one of these hundreds of uncensored English-language releases has ever received any form of public backlash (not even the morally-offensive ones like Virgin Roster). The only title to receive any such degree of infamy was Rapelay, which had neither an official English release nor any form of decensorship. That’s even taking into account the thousands of official, uncensored adult manga and adult animation titles released over the years…
As one poster already pointed out, minori is just using the Rapelay debacle to rationalize its unwillingness to release ef’s original uncensored artwork. The Rapelay controversy has nothing to do with content or context of ef’s English release beyond the mere fact that both titles include sexually-explicit material; minori is using Rapelay as a convenient strawman. If they were indeed concerned about someone re-inserting the graphics back into the Japanese version of the game, they could have simply followed Nitroplus’s lead and watermark the graphics, clearly labeling them as being part of the overseas edition and not the original Japanese release.
I can agree with *what* minori is doing, but I don’t for a second believe the *why* they have provided us, especially given the amount of precedent disproving their argument. If, by some chance, they are indeed being sincere about their reasoning, then I take offense at the blatant lack of research that went into their their decision-making process; it merely confirms that they do not care about the overseas market any more than they did when they blocked foreigners from visiting their site.
Regardless, my standard gaming rule applies: if I can run ef on my offline-only laptop, I’ll buy it. If I can’t, no sale. In the end, that’s all that really matters to me. MangaGamer, I sincerely hope a physical pressing of the game is in the works…
…I take back what I said in my earlier post. There are more factors at work here than any of us are aware of. I’m disappointed by the necessity of having to release the original graphics in an at least partially censored format, but I’ll recognize that this is indeed a necessity and not a decision that was made lightly.
If this is the “price” that must be “paid” to ensure future English-language releases from minori, so be it. I can be satisfied with the knowledge that this isn’t anywhere near as arbitrary as the voices of Kara no Shojo…
We actually brought up those same issues and more to minori, as well as suggesting the watermark idea and that Nitro+ had done so.
I would like to thank minori for explaining everything and I do agree with them. Being proactive is better than being reactive.
As for the topic of mosaics… who cares!? I will buy this game for one reason: the story. You want uncensored nudity, there are plenty of other venues.
There are many visual novels with wonderful stories to tell and that’s what it’s about.
I look forward to the release! Any extras like an art book or something would be much appreciated.
Don’t know why people are making such a fuss over it too when they’ve been praising the story in Ef as top tier.
Questions to those people,
Seems like Ef’s story isn’t that great without uncensored ero content. And here I thought people are saying Ef’s story is top tier….what if Ef didn’t have the ero content? Is it still top tier? Yes? Then what if it had ero with mosaics? Is it still top tier? Can’t answer eh? Well to me it seems that uncensored CGs would increase the awesomeness of the story to those guys. There’s Magical Teacher that just released not too long ago, its uncensored so go buy it.
Think I know who the liars are and its certainly not Minori.
*Face palm* ef has a good story,but that’s beside the point people are making.
The point is Minori is full of shit and censorship sucks balls.
“What you lost was the only reason people cared about this release…….Uncensored cgs”
Funny thing “CENSORED” is that you also stated that you own both the First and Latter tales…….Minori full of shit? Seriously? Either you are a fan or able to read their written language. Assuming that if you can read it, then why are you fussing over mosaics to an eroge that came out in 2006?
I, for one, did not go after the fan translation when it was distributed back then so I DO have an incentive to buy this and its definitely for the story and to “support” the western eroge market not for some uncensored penis, fool.
Of course they are being excessively paranoid and they probably don’t really care about the western market because last I check….1000 sales, no matter how you look at it, is still shit when compared to their own country’s numbers.
We….got a lot of money? Stop lying to yourselves fools, when most of you are always complaining about prices. US dollar is shit when compared to how strong the yen is now days.
“Of course they are being excessively paranoid and they probably don’t really care about the western market because last I check….1000 sales, no matter how you look at it, is still shit when compared to their own country’s numbers.”
Not to mention, that the price of video games in Japan is higher than in the US and Europe.
“We….got a lot of money? Stop lying to yourselves fools, when most of you are always complaining about prices. US dollar is shit when compared to how strong the yen is now days.”
Nah, it doesn’t have anything to do with that, the yen is not a strong currency.
99 euros in yen = 10,613 Yen
Going from 2 numbers to 5 after conversion is not a the sign of a strong currency.
A currency that is strong is the Euro and the USD, not the yen, the difference is that the prices in Japan for entertainment and electronic products are inflated, while in Europe and North America they aren’t. Reason for that is that Japanese otakus are so “dedicated” (understand obsessive-compulsive) that they’ll keep on purchasing their entertainment even if the companies decide to inflate the prices even more.
The japanese can pay up any amount they want, it’s their problem, but let me tell you that the kind of BS that japanese fans put with (500 USD for an 11 episode serie, dispersed on 6 volumes) won’t fly here, a good example of that is Bandai America who tried to apply the japanese model selling methods, look where it got them! And it doesn’t look like they learned their lesson because now they are trying to sell the upcoming Volume 5 of Gundam Unicorn (80 minutes episode) for 128 USD, hahaha get out of here!
“Seems like Ef’s story isn’t that great without uncensored ero content. And here I thought people are saying Ef’s story is top tier….what if Ef didn’t have the ero content? Is it still top tier? Yes? Then what if it had ero with mosaics? Is it still top tier? Can’t answer eh? Well to me it seems that uncensored CGs would increase the awesomeness of the story to those guys. There’s Magical Teacher that just released not too long ago, its uncensored so go buy it.”
Nonsense, the anime is fantastic, the story is fantastic, the anime is adapated from the game, so yeah…
You are clearly retarded. I’m not going to go in depth as to why Minori is full of shit. If you’re interested read Tinfoils posts. He covers pretty much everything.
It’s really not a matter of how much legal backlash they can actually get, but rather minori is just afraid, and fear ignores rationale.
They chose to self-censor, and so be it. Nothing of value is lost and if people feel this pathetic bit of censorship will somehow ruin the game for them–well, then you may want to spend your money on some real porn instead of whining over the internet.
“But it’s about the ethics of censorship!!”
I seriously doubt this will somehow propagate censorship, so once again, nothing of value is lost…
Your concept for the euro vs yen, turning 5 digits after conversion = weak yen is totally wrong. Isn’t 1 yen something like 1 cent since the yen is the only unit while USA has the dollar and cents. So 100 yen would be something like 1.00 usd.
So if I’m buying lets say for example the Fate/Zero 5bluray set from CDJapan which is going for 39900yen with tax I’ll be paying $462.62. When I started importing goods from Japan I used to pay something like $21.00 for 2300yen. Now I’m paying like $28.00 for 2300yen. From my point of view the Yen is clearly stronger than the USD.
……calling names then hiding behind someone else? I read Tinfoil’s post and I honestly agree with it but not the “we got a lot of money.” That’s why I pointed it out, fool. But I can’t really care since uncensored penis in a story heavy eroge is really just ridiculous to be the deciding factor for buying or not if one has never pirated it and read it, fool.
Oh and while on this topic of mosaic…..what if Air or Kanon got brought over but mosaics are kept and the projects takes longer than expected………..is Key the famed developer everyone worships….full of shit?
Here’s a scenario, since mostly everyone has read Fate Stay Night I guess an english localization would be pointless too and a waste of time if Type-Moon for some reason decides to not include uncensored CGs……even though people kept asking them for an official FSN. Honestly…….are people going to read FSN for uncensored H-scenes too?
Honestly whining over still images for not being uncensored and claiming not to buy or support is just retarded. The only result is the Japanese devs confirming that there is no market in the west, fools. Making the possibility of acquiring great eroge titles from many other eroge devs completely zero. There are titles I’d like to see that have zero possibility that a fan translator would pick up but if the western market expand there is still a possibility. Call me retarded but at least I dont have an uncensored **n*s up my ass XD
Here are an example of currencies who are not strong.
100 British pounds = 13,110 Yen
100 British pounds = 9,251 Syrian Pounds
100 British pounds = 4,736 Russian rubles
See any pattern?
Compare this to conversions between currencies who are both fairly strong.
100 British Pounds = 161 American Dollars
100 British pounds = 146 Swiss francs
100 British Pounds = 122 Euros
As you can see the British pound is still a stronger currency compared to the dollar, the swiss franc and the euro, but unlike the yen, syrian pound and russian rubles, they are not by much, especially the euro.
More does not equal better.
And anyways, you’re not japanese so why would you wish for the yen to be a stronger currency than the USD, EUR or GBP?
I’m not saying I want the yen to be stronger than the US dollar. I’m just saying that it is. And I hate the fact that I’m paying more USD for Japan goods this day than when I did several years back.
Reading your comment has only confused me more than needed. From what I’m reading based on your comment, you fail to see how the Japanese Yen works. There is no other unit of currency in Japan besides the Yen while USA has two, the dollar and the cent , equaling one one-hundredth of the US dollar.
If converting $1.00 to yen only nets me ¥80.9, this means the yen is stronger, meaning that a Japanese person only needs about ¥81 to purchase a dollar. That is to say, using the logic behind USA’s two unit of currency, they only need 0.81 cents to purchase a US dollar, not $81.00 to purchase a dollar.
Just because a Japanese person would need to use ¥10,000 to purchase $123.58 doesn’t mean the Yen is so weak that it needed a number of 10000 to net 100, though in Koihime/Dynasty Warriors one warrior equating to that of ten thousand sounds awesome.
I’m not sure if you’re an expert on the topic of currency but where ever I look on the net, it is saying the yen is currently stronger than the dollar as of now. If you are, I’d like a link to a site that can clearly explain to me how the Yen works and why its not a strong currency so I may become smarter. Note: do not provide a link with info dating back to WWII, I already know that that was when the Yen was at its all time low, exchanging ¥360 to $1.00.
It’d be great if Kouryuu or someone else who studied the language can correct this whole confusion between the Yen and dollar.
Funny story, the anime industry would like for the dollar to be worth more as well. They would get a better profit margin on all import sales and people would buy more since things get a bit cheaper…
The Euro strengthened while Japanese Yen weakens:
Yen Weaker on Dovish BoJ, Pound Stronger on Increasingly Hawkish BoE:
Yen Weakens. The currency dropped to 84.18 per dollar on March 15, the lowest since April 2011:
For anime now Japanese people pay 500 dollars for 11 episodes distributed on 6 volumes, we pay 40 dollars for 11 episodes in one package.
In 2010 a game in Japan on Playstation 3 or Xbox 360 used to cost about 90 USD, one year later in 2011 the price jumped from 90 USD to 120 USD, if you can’t comprehend what that means than I am afraid “CENSORED” was right about you.
comparing the absolute values of currencies is retarded, you have to look at the trends:
JPY is strengthening at a furious pace since 2007 (2007: 1usd= 123 yen 2012: 1 usd = 78 yen approx. +60%), sure it is “dropped” to 84.18 per dollars in march, but in feb. it was amazingly strong, one of the best moment for that currency in history.
If you compare it to weak currencies like GBP its increase is even more amazing:
(almost +100% in 5 years)
Oh my GOD!!!
The first talks about Japan’s GDP dropping .02%, the second one states its decline against others from like what? 0.61 percent? You serious?
3rd one about Toyota….LOL
please re-read this article. Its actually about “exports” and google that and read too since you obviously failed here. Toyota wants BOJ to weaken its currency <- Key info there.
Also as an example: "Euromoney Institutional Investor Plc, expects theyen to weaken to 85 per dollar in the next six months from 83.13as of 9:46 a.m. today." Key words, "weaken to" – "from" Switch the sentence around if you don't understand…the yen weakens from 83 to 85 against the dollar. Now can YOU comprehend this? It weakens by rising…..and before it was like what from winterfury, 123yen/1usd.
"For anime now Japanese people pay 500 dollars for 11 episodes distributed on 6 volumes, we pay 40 dollars for 11 episodes in one package." etc.
You do realize your statement here is just retarded in and of itself right? It doesn't even make sense as to why you claim yen < usd. But, I guess you must think I'm the one. Sheesh do you even import stuff from Japan? If yes, are u paying less or are you paying more now than like what, 5 years ago?
And if you still think I'm retarded, here's winterfury's comment "JPY is strengthening at a furious pace since 2007 (2007: 1usd= 123 yen 2012: 1 usd = 78 yen approx. +60%), sure it is “dropped” to 84.18 per dollars in march, but in feb. it was amazingly strong, one of the best moment for that currency in history." read his whole comment over and over if you still cant get it. And check the graphs. Also "60%" gain vs. ".61%" loss. I like you, you make me laugh.
And from a 2011 interview with bamboo, "We’re really sweating it! The high yen is making things really bad! It’s really tough! Somebody do something about the US’s economy! If this high-yen keeps up, it’ll be hard to keep doing business! I never once in my life imagined I’d see my business getting this influenced by high-yen [exchange rates]." Don't get it? Go google and read what a high currency does to a country who relies on exports.
Oh forgot, you believed that 1.00usd to 100yen = the yen being weak……because a single digit going to 3 equates to a weak currency(in reference to the yen)? I'd love to see how the world ends up as the yen becomes 1yen to 1.00usd then. 1 digit to 1 digit.
I'm not going to argue with you anymore now, so go celebrate your (false?) victory if you still believe I'm wrong and a huge retard. Thanks though I've definitely gotten a lot smarter. (^0^)/
Just wanted to say, “Better than supporting you’s paranoid.”
yagami’s comment is gone, now mine looks weird lol
Too bad he can’t just be banned and then we’d be free from his inane ranting…
What’s the fuss? Sure, censorship blows, but that’s the fault of the system, not Minori. They’re just trying to cover their a$s from the man. Mosaics or not, I’m excited for the game, and I look forward to its release.
How about reading Tinfoil’s masterpiece?
oh, pretty landscapes. And, so that’s where that rooftop scene came from, saw a part of it in an gif long time ago so I’ve been wondering for quite some time now. Good to know xD
And btw, anyone notice evospace got new avatar nao? Me thinks Me likes.
Hard copies will be forthcoming in the near future?
You know the mosaic has been thinned enough that I think it’s an accepatble compromise. You’d be hard pressed to find a good doujinshi or H anime with that thin a mosaic
i can understand where their coming from but ant they also opening themselfs up to pirated software and loss of sales because of the reduced mosaic i could care less if i see a pussy and dick or not more into the story based VNs but im sure 3 weeks laster their will be a pirated patch to take away reduced to make it without so in the long run ant what they feared going to happen anyways
I think that they decided to keep the mosaics because the genitalia drawings are ugly.
However, Makoto Shinkai is truly a great artist, guys!
I understand what they chose to do, but MG has games from many companies and this would slow down the Japanese goverment from moving away from censorship and in courage not to let go of old laws. I have no idea where the JAST get thier games from, but I’m pretty sure that they’re from other Japanese companies and they got School Days HQ. If Minori joined the fight now, I would think it would push for change in the old Japanese censorship laws. This is all just my opinion, I just think that the censorship laws devalues the Japanese’s artistic value.
I, too, think Minori is a little paranoid about this.
Think of it, however, from a purely business standpoint. ef is a fairly well known property, so it can expect to sell decently. Let me pull a few speculative numbers out (though changes to most of the numbers don’t make much of a difference) For arguments sake, let’s say it sells as well as Koihime Musou did. That’s still only about 2,000 copies in one year. That’s it. We have a fairly niche market. If minori is handling most of the translation and port development in addition to redoing their mosaics, they can expect to reap the majority of revenue.
Let’s say 75% for argument, (purely speculative, just a baseline figure) That means they net $24 for every copy sold. So in one year it makes them $48,000. That’s not much for a company. They still want the additional sales that would come from reducing censoring (otherwise people would just go get the fan translation), but don’t want to even remotely risk the amount of money it would cost them if they got into a legal issue over this. And even when uncensored CGs do surface, they can cover themselves by claiming they did everything they could to encourage people not to do that. That’s protecting themselves from liability.
I still think it is paranoid, but it makes perfect sense from a business perspective.
Well, now I know what game I wont be buying.
I too think they are being insanely paranoid here, fortunately for them I still badly want to play ef, so I’ll be buying regardless.
I can still fap even with mosaics.
By the way, how come mangagamer lowered the price of ef from 40€ to 25€?
It is not the entire game, ef the first tale is the first half of the game and the latter tale will be the second half.
Is fine to me that little amount of Mosaics in the game Mangagamer provide. I also belive is too paranoic, and if someone use a patch to change the japanese game then is the fault of who patched the game, not the company.
I really don’t care, I usually skip that crap pressing CTRL button.
I actually would have preferred an all age version or a backport of the PS2 version.
Oh, and I agree with Minori, a decensor patch could be dangerous, for a VN like this one with completely futile H-scenes(otherwise the game would have never been ported to PS2) the risk is way too big even if there’s only the smallest chance that such patch would be done and would effectively damage the company.
You may argue that other companies have never had any problems YET.
yes… YET. The future is unknown.
(oh shit, my written english sucks)
The ps2 version used lower quality backgrounds (very noticibly so), you wouldn’t have wanted it…
“I actually would have preferred an all age version or a backport of the PS2 version.”
Same here, I like visual novels, but not for porn. This is why Witch on a Holy Night is the VN with top priority for me.
Sex scene with Miyako was very good i enjoyed it back then when i played the game. Will read it again:)
Also im very happy with censored version – thanks minori. All the games should be censored like this one.
minori just went full tinfoil hat
“Just”? Minori has always been full tin foil…
Thank you for the good writeup. It in fact was a amusement account it.
Look advanced to more added agreeable from you! However,
how could we communicate?
Ok they are right.
Also anyone buying ef for the porn is plainly stupid, so who cares.